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Malibu
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BOA Sheets

Post by Malibu » Tue Oct 19, 2004 6:31 am

I recently attended a show that uses BOA sheets. In addition to the standard sheet, they added an extra visual judge whose responsibilities were to watch the band, drumline and color guard all at the same time. From that, a best guard was to be chosen without scores for individual sections. In other words, no evidence for mistakes that could be made.
I feel one judge can not look at all that especially with some bands being over 200, to remember everything that transpired in each section and then chose a winner without individual scores.

In WGI it takes 5-8 judges looking at 5-36 members on a floor to come up with one score. So they are trying to tell me that one judge looking at over 200 can pick a winner from that? I say there is a flaw in their judging system and they should either hire separate caption judges (like guard, DM, drumline) or do away with those awards. Sorry to rant, but injustice has been done and I am currently in a hot email debate with the assistant director of that show. :twisted: :roll:
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Post by Resume Hut » Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:18 am

I'm reminded of experiences in which I've jotted down subjective impressions of who was best as I scored things more objectively, and discovered later when I tallied up the objective data that it often doesn't match up with the subjective impressions.

This overall BOA visual caption is more likely to be awarded to the band with the best program, or tradition, or friendship of somebody on the staff with the judge... something other than the "best performance". Bad idea.
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Post by LAMystreaux » Tue Oct 19, 2004 2:19 pm

This is a big debate brewing here in Texas. At UIL, which is our state sanctioned contest(s) that go from the region level all the way to the state marching band championships, you have between 3-5 judges only looking at bands as big as 300+. Some people have a problem with that.
Just because your hate is masked by "free thinking" or being "open-minded" does not make it right.

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Post by Resume Hut » Tue Oct 19, 2004 3:16 pm

Go Figure! Are the Texas judges just evaluating overall impressions, or does each judge have a caption responsibility that involves scoring 75 kids, or whatever?

Hey, speaking of Texas marching bands, there was this fun story of adults responsible for kids not thinking things through and running amok:

FORT WORTH, Texas (AP) -- A veteran firefighter from the Southlake Department of Public Safety has been fired for supervising the hosing down of the Southlake Carroll band and color guard, injuring 13 students...

An internal investigation showed... employees violated department safety policies. At times, the students were hit directly by the water; it was not directed over their heads, according to Southlake reports.

"I think it was a very unfortunate incident," said Jan Nelson, of Southlake, whose 14-year-old daughter suffered a sprained knee in the incident. "Had my daughter been the one who had a major amount of problems, I would probably feel differently."

One color guard student, Liz Schmiedel, 16, suffered a knocked-out tooth, three loosened and chipped teeth and abrasions to her lips, chin, hip, knees, hand and wrist.

The band and color guard were hosed down as part of a spirit-motivating exercise...

Click HERE for the whole story
"These are the roots of rhythm and the roots of rhythm remain"-- Paul Simon

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Post by LAMystreaux » Wed Oct 20, 2004 8:34 pm

Yes, that story has been all over here in the state. I am not sure if the guy still has his job. Big oops there.

As far as the judging, when it comes to UIL Marching events at the Region level you have 3 judges judging overall. . .no caption awards, just ratings.

When it gets to area and state you have 5 judges I think. . .3 music, 2 marching and it is basically a rank system to determine those who advance and ultimately your state champion band.

The big main issue I have seen discussed is more at the region level and also at local contests throughout the state prior to UIL as to if the judges being used are qualified. They have to fulfill a certain amount of requirements time wise of classes/seminars. . .and I think there are rules about their own bands and the ratings they have received.

Anyway, as a band director myself, I try not to place too much emphasis on ratings, as difficult as that is. But, at the end of the day we (us directors and the kids) just have to be content with our hard work and the product we put out on the field, as long as we are doing our best.
Just because your hate is masked by "free thinking" or being "open-minded" does not make it right.

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Post by WE ARE SPARTACI » Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:41 am

TXMystreaux wrote:As far as the judging, when it comes to UIL Marching events at the Region level you have 3 judges judging overall. . .no caption awards, just ratings.


Do you mean like Superior, Excellent, Satisfactory type ratings? Or is it more involved than that?
What, it should be Spartacuses??

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Post by LAMystreaux » Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:09 am

xsabers wrote:
TXMystreaux wrote:As far as the judging, when it comes to UIL Marching events at the Region level you have 3 judges judging overall. . .no caption awards, just ratings.


Do you mean like Superior, Excellent, Satisfactory type ratings? Or is it more involved than that?


Yes
I
II
III
IV
. . . and so on

But at area and state bands just get ranked.
Just because your hate is masked by "free thinking" or being "open-minded" does not make it right.

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Post by Malibu » Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:31 am

TXMystreaux wrote:
xsabers wrote:
TXMystreaux wrote:As far as the judging, when it comes to UIL Marching events at the Region level you have 3 judges judging overall. . .no caption awards, just ratings.


Do you mean like Superior, Excellent, Satisfactory type ratings? Or is it more involved than that?


Yes
I
II
III
IV
. . . and so on

But at area and state bands just get ranked.


Tx, we have that here as well.....it's called VBODA (Virginia, Band, Orchestra Association). Mostly judged by a bunch of "old pharts" but I can't complain, the band I work with has had superior ratings since 1988. We go to that next weekend. :)
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Post by WE ARE SPARTACI » Thu Oct 21, 2004 2:06 pm

Malibu wrote:
TXMystreaux wrote:
xsabers wrote:
TXMystreaux wrote:As far as the judging, when it comes to UIL Marching events at the Region level you have 3 judges judging overall. . .no caption awards, just ratings.


Do you mean like Superior, Excellent, Satisfactory type ratings? Or is it more involved than that?


Yes
I
II
III
IV
. . . and so on

But at area and state bands just get ranked.


Tx, we have that here as well.....it's called VBODA (Virginia, Band, Orchestra Association). Mostly judged by a bunch of "old pharts" but I can't complain, the band I work with has had superior ratings since 1988. We go to that next weekend. :)

So 17 years of Superior ratings. How do they measure improvement? Are the Superior ratings earned at every show or do they start out at Excellent, but end up at Superior?

Does anyone know the rational behind this? I sure hope it's not just a PC thing although I suspect there is at least an element of that.
What, it should be Spartacuses??

Music is like candy; to get to the good stuff, you have to remove the rappers...

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Post by Malibu » Thu Oct 21, 2004 5:20 pm

xsabers, the reason why many bands go to that is so when they go to the music festival (concert with ratings judged by old pharts that is held in March) to try to receive superior ratings there. If they get a superior rating in the concert portion too, they become a Virginia Honor Band that comes with a plaque. :roll:

Now as far as how they are rated, it's at that one show.....based on their performance but heavily weighed on music. I think there are 5 music judges who have one total sheet and one guard judge (usually a judge with a music degree).
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